RE: Africans are lazy

[An Amateur]

This is a responce to Mr.Lucifers posts in another topic in which he states that all Africans are lazy and do not exploit the oportunities available to them in order to get themselves out of poverty:
Facts and Myths of Global warming

So far I have yet to see any evidence of this, so is this a commonly held view?

Here are some sources I found that suggest quite different and to be honest more believable explanations than that an entire country is lazy.

Why Is Africa Still Poor?

Google: "Why is Africa poor?" Many of my sources opened as PDF documents that im unable to link to, however I believe you should use your own sources rather than relying on what I provide as I may have my own bias.

[Ultra Burger]

Well some generalizations are pretty true. All the ******s around here don't do nothing. I have a few really good black friends, and their families are pretty cool and keep a well-paying stable job. But there is also alot of white-trash that can be tossed into the same category.

[Mr.Lucifer]

Originally Posted by Ultra Burger

Well some generalizations are pretty true. All the ******s around here don't do nothing. I have a few really good black friends, and their families are pretty cool and keep a well-paying stable job. But there is also alot of white-trash that can be tossed into the same category.

True. I'm talking about the majority of those who live in Africa right now and my opinion is that they are lazy.

When I was ten years old one of my teachers, a good teacher at that, came back from Uganda and told us how it was there. She told us the students were eager to learn, but their teachers and parents weren't eager to teach. Their parents despised having them go to school and the teachers didn't like kids. The new generation could be the one who digs up Africa from the dirt, yet they are held back by the older ones.

Another good reason to the "Why is Africa still poor" is of course, corruption.

This isn't about race at all, in case anyone draws that conclusion.

[An Amateur]

Originally Posted by Mr.Lucifer

True. I'm talking about the majority of those who live in Africa right now and my opinion is that they are lazy.

When I was ten years old one of my teachers, a good teacher at that, came back from Uganda and told us how it was there. She told us the students were eager to learn, but their teachers and parents weren't eager to teach. Their parents despised having them go to school and the teachers didn't like kids. The new generation could be the one who digs up Africa from the dirt, yet they are held back by the older ones.

Another good reason to the "Why is Africa still poor" is of course, corruption.

This isn't about race at all, in case anyone draws that conclusion.

Now your changing the goal post. You no longer saying that its Aficans fault cause they are all lazy.

If those kids were eager to learn there is no reason to think that they are lazy. As for the parents, you can't expect someone with little or no education to be eager to teach, they just don't know it! You also cannot surmise that they are lazy because of this, chances are the spend much of there time trying to provide for there family through work. You also cannot say that because there children are not able to attend a school this is the case. Because in countries where the pay is bellow the needed income to survive every extra hand no matter how small might be the difference between eating or starving.

As for the teachers, were still talking about a generalisation of an entire continent based on one small school in Uganda from a second had source. While there maybe cases of this I find it a more plausable explination that the schools are under funder, under equiped, and teacher are under trained and probalby under paid as well.

If you cared to simple scan through the article that I post a link too you would realise that there are many theories proposed by experts as to why Africa suffers so badly...not one mentions or even implies lazyness as a factor.

Care to reformulate your point of view?

[Mr.Lucifer]

Originally Posted by An Amateur

Now your changing the goal post. You no longer saying that its Aficans fault cause they are all lazy.

If those kids were eager to learn there is no reason to think that they are lazy. As for the parents, you can't expect someone with little or no education to be eager to teach, they just don't know it! You also cannot surmise that they are lazy because of this, chances are the spend much of there time trying to provide for there family through work. You also cannot say that because there children are not able to attend a school this is the case. Because in countries where the pay is bellow the needed income to survive every extra hand no matter how small might be the difference between eating or starving.

As for the teachers, were still talking about a generalisation of an entire continent based on one small school in Uganda from a second had source. While there maybe cases of this I find it a more plausable explination that the schools are under funder, under equiped, and teacher are under trained and probalby under paid as well.

If you cared to simple scan through the article that I post a link too you would realise that there are many theories proposed by experts as to why Africa suffers so badly...not one mentions or even implies lazyness as a factor.

Care to reformulate your point of view?

I believe you misintepreted me right from the start. An African is someone who lives in Africa and that's what I've been talking about all the time. I were never talking about ethnic africans are generally lazy as it is in their race. It's more of a cultural thing. If you missed that I wonder if you ever even read my posts.

The parents didn't want to work for themself. They were tired. Must I really explain every single thing? Also, life experience is just as vital as learning how to read. Parents could at least teach their kids the little they have learnt. It gives the kids something to live for.

When I say the parents didn't want to work themself I'm not making it up. It's exactly what my teacher said, I also read an article about it a year or so ago. I understand how they need all the hands they can get to avoid starving, but this was not the case where my teacher was.

The teachers are underpaid, they don't have good lives. But they live in Africa. If the teachers can't teach the kids, the kids wont learn. And if the money I donate to African schools don't teach kids anything, I want my money back. I give money so they can learn. Many give money so they can learn. They should get enough money, don't you think?

[Heidenreich8]

They aren't lazy, they got their tribal wars, mutilation of women and rigging the elections.

[An Amateur]

Originally Posted by Mr.Lucifer

I believe you misintepreted me right from the start. An African is someone who lives in Africa and that's what I've been talking about all the time. I were never talking about ethnic africans are generally lazy as it is in their race. It's more of a cultural thing. If you missed that I wonder if you ever even read my posts.

No i didn't missinterpret you. Your still making generalisations about the people that live on an entire continent based off one place on one second hand source.

The parents didn't want to work for themself. They were tired. Must I really explain every single thing? Also, life experience is just as vital as learning how to read. Parents could at least teach their kids the little they have learnt. It gives the kids something to live for.

When I say the parents didn't want to work themself I'm not making it up. It's exactly what my teacher said, I also read an article about it a year or so ago. I understand how they need all the hands they can get to avoid starving, but this was not the case where my teacher was.

The teachers are underpaid, they don't have good lives. But they live in Africa. If the teachers can't teach the kids, the kids wont learn.

~sigh~ I am not gonna repeat myself anymore. You say you read an article on it, where? when? title? auther? Other sources? If one person wrote an article on it I am sure that there is more information out there. Until you come up with something more reawsonable I refuse to enter "serious" discussion with you.

... if the money I donate to African schools don't teach kids anything, I want my money back. I give money so they can learn. Many give money so they can learn. They should get enough money, don't you think?

Then perhaps you should research a charity before you donate money. Find out where its going and how its being spent and if it is working. Your quite right to be concerned about how charities and aid money is spent however this reflects the systems that are in place not the people who live in an entire country as a whole.

[Mr.Lucifer]

Originally Posted by Heidenreich8

They aren't lazy, they got their tribal wars, mutilation of women and rigging the elections.

That is what I ment by lazy, if my post had been fully read beyond the word lazy this thread may not have been made. They simply don't use their opportunities because they don't bother to. How are you supposed to help that?

Originally Posted by An Amateur

No i didn't missinterpret you. Your still making generalisations about the people that live on an entire continent based off one place on one second hand source.



~sigh~ I am not gonna repeat myself anymore. You say you read an article on it, where? when? title? auther? Other sources? If one person wrote an article on it I am sure that there is more information out there. Until you come up with something more reawsonable I refuse to enter "serious" discussion with you.



Then perhaps you should research a charity before you donate money. Find out where its going and how its being spent and if it is working. Your quite right to be concerned about how charities and aid money is spent however this reflects the systems that are in place not the people who live in an entire country as a whole.

Fact:

Somalian men are the minority who abuse Norways welfare system the most.
90% of gang rapes are done by Somalians.
Less than 0.5% of the Norwegian population are from Somalia.
Africans are the ones who integrate the least.
More than 70% of Norwegian immigrants who cannot speak the Norwegian languange after 2 years in the country are from Africa.
Less than 15% of those who has immigrated to Norway after 1960 are African.

Statistisk sentralbyrå - Forside

Feel free to search them up. I hate navigating the site. And in case you still don't understand half my examples, they don't bother to integrate. Yet they are the ones who bothered to fight to get here.

I can't know if my money reaches where I want the correct way unless there are public information about it. What the hell do you want me to do? Go down to Africa and film a special report on poor kids in Etiopia and how the donations could be used better? Seriously, do you think every single problem in the world is perfectly documented, reasearched, made a thousand articles of and approved by everyone? Not even a genocide with 1 million casualities is officially approved by every government, including England. Why do you think a possibility recently thought up should be?

[An Amateur]

Originally Posted by Mr.Lucifer

That is what I ment by lazy, if my post had been fully read beyond the word lazy this thread may not have been made. They simply don't use their opportunities because they don't bother to. How are you supposed to help that?

I had more reasons to make this thread than because I simply don't agree with you as well as reasons outside of personal attack or maliciousness.

The problem with that is, you are using a word that is not at all apt to describe what you now state. What opportunities? Political tensions, wars, famine, brutal dictatorships are not something that I can ever imagine describing as lazy. In fact these corrupt government and brutal wars require a lot of effort and motivation and there is little doubt that those actively involved in them believe that they are doing the right thing or are taking advantage of a great opportunity for there followers, (or for themselves). These people must be fairly hard working and motivated to do such things. And for those that endure the same is true as they still make do with what they have and work hard to survive.

Fact:

Somalian men are the minority who abuse Norways welfare system the most.
90% of gang rapes are done by Somalians.
Less than 0.5% of the Norwegian population are from Somalia.
Africans are the ones who integrate the least.
More than 70% of Norwegian immigrants who cannot speak the Norwegian languange after 2 years in the country are from Africa.
Less than 15% of those who has immigrated to Norway after 1960 are African.

Compared to what other minorities?

Norwegian men are the minority who abuse Englands welfare system the most.
10% of gang rapes are done by Norwegians.
Less than 0.8% of the english population are from norway.
Norwegians are the ones who integrate one of the least.
More than 50% of english immigrants who cannot speak the English languange after 2 years in the country are from Norway.
Less than 15% of those who has immigrated to England after 1960 are Norwegian.

These are completely ficticious figures I made up...but compared to Somalian imigrants to Norway, Norwegian imigrants to England are better behaved. You need a control group and a way to compare figures to prove that statistics such as this are actually bad.

Statistisk sentralbyrå - Forside
Since this is in norwegian I can't understand it. Sorry.
Feel free to search them up. I hate navigating the site. And in case you still don't understand half my examples, they don't bother to integrate. Yet they are the ones who bothered to fight to get here.

I can't know if my money reaches where I want the correct way unless there are public information about it. What the hell do you want me to do? Go down to Africa and film a special report on poor kids in Etiopia and how the donations could be used better? Seriously, do you think every single problem in the world is perfectly documented, reasearched, made a thousand articles of and approved by everyone?

No I don't think everything is perfectly documented but I think if you don't look you won't know.

In less than a minute I found this:
How to tell a good charity from a bad one - MSN Money
How to Select a Charity and not get Taken (which has many other sources)

If you've though of a question there is a good chance someone else thought of it too and the answers or at least indicaters may be out there but you have to look.

[LordShaft]

Africa - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

[Sinjihn]

how about we let africa solve its own problems.

I mean, alot of other countries have gotten out of downslides themselves, the great Depression, russia's destruction during WWII, Germany, Italy, Vietnam is still poor, but they are getting there.

I mean, africa was robbed the most but i can't say that its everyone elses fault. Because if they would just unite as a country it would be alot easier to pull themselves out of crisis.

[An Amateur]

Originally Posted by Sinjihn

how about we let africa solve its own problems.

I mean, alot of other countries have gotten out of downslides themselves, the great Depression, russia's destruction during WWII, Germany, Italy, Vietnam is still poor, but they are getting there.

I mean, africa was robbed the most but i can't say that its everyone elses fault. Because if they would just unite as a country it would be alot easier to pull themselves out of crisis.

Okay. Just to point out that Africa is not a country unless you refer to South Africa, were talking about an entire continent here.

The difference between Africa and all the other countries you have listed is huge. For a start, as I have already pointed out, Africa is a continent consisting of many countries, languages and cultures. Secondly the problems in Africa have lasted far far longer than any of the other countries you have mentioned and there is no real sign that they are on the road to recovery just yet.

You don't see why its everyone elses problem? Heres why its our problem too:
Support Aide for Africa: « I find hope
The Walrus » Canada » Environmental Issues Politics Arts Culture » Magazine Subscription

The fact is that many of our ancestors have contributed to the problems in Africa today. We have had a part in behaviour that violated human rights, occupied their land etc. Just as we would have a killer punished for there crimes we should try to make a mends for our crimes.

[Mr.Lucifer]

Originally Posted by An Amateur

I had more reasons to make this thread than because I simply don't agree with you as well as reasons outside of personal attack or maliciousness.

The problem with that is, you are using a word that is not at all apt to describe what you now state. What opportunities? Political tensions, wars, famine, brutal dictatorships are not something that I can ever imagine describing as lazy. In fact these corrupt government and brutal wars require a lot of effort and motivation and there is little doubt that those actively involved in them believe that they are doing the right thing or are taking advantage of a great opportunity for there followers, (or for themselves). These people must be fairly hard working and motivated to do such things. And for those that endure the same is true as they still make do with what they have and work hard to survive.


Compared to what other minorities?

Norwegian men are the minority who abuse Englands welfare system the most.
10% of gang rapes are done by Norwegians.
Less than 0.8% of the english population are from norway.
Norwegians are the ones who integrate one of the least.
More than 50% of english immigrants who cannot speak the English languange after 2 years in the country are from Norway.
Less than 15% of those who has immigrated to England after 1960 are Norwegian.

These are completely ficticious figures I made up...but compared to Somalian imigrants to Norway, Norwegian imigrants to England are better behaved. You need a control group and a way to compare figures to prove that statistics such as this are actually bad.

Statistisk sentralbyrå - Forside
Since this is in norwegian I can't understand it. Sorry.
Feel free to search them up. I hate navigating the site. And in case you still don't understand half my examples, they don't bother to integrate. Yet they are the ones who bothered to fight to get here.


No I don't think everything is perfectly documented but I think if you don't look you won't know.

In less than a minute I found this:
How to tell a good charity from a bad one - MSN Money
How to Select a Charity and not get Taken (which has many other sources)

If you've though of a question there is a good chance someone else thought of it too and the answers or at least indicaters may be out there but you have to look.

By lazy I mean someone who simply don't bother to:

1. averse or disinclined to work, activity, or exertion; indolent.
They are disinclined to work for a better world for themself.

I'm not saying I am better. What I'm saying is, they have to work. We can't work for them. They have to feel they have an identity and take control themself. They have to choose how to control. Iraq is a good example of what happens when someone else takes control and "fix" the problem.

Those are compared to every other immigrants since 1960. That's approximately 10% of our current population. Pakistan, Afghanistan, Iran, Russia, Vietnam...

If it was as easy as just checking a list to see if a charity does it good enough... I don't need to know about one child who had been saved, I want to know what they do to help the Africans in general. I want to know if what I donate today can result in a new Africa.

[An Amateur]

Originally Posted by Mr.Lucifer

By lazy I mean someone who simply don't bother to:

1. averse or disinclined to work, activity, or exertion; indolent.
They are [url="http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/disinclined"]

This is the definition of lazyness yes.

for a better world for themself.

This is not and therfore causes confusion.

I'm not gonna argue about semantics anymore. I do think that you should choose the words a little more carefully, or explain what you mean more clearly in future because to use the wrong word and generalise in the way you originally did does reflect on you.

I'm not saying I am better. What I'm saying is, they have to work. We can't work for them. They have to feel they have an identity and take control themself. They have to choose how to control. Iraq is a good example of what happens when someone else takes control and "fix" the problem.

Your right, but most Africans DO work and work hard. The people with the power to do that are the rich, powerful and leaders of the countries and militant groups etc.

But how are you gonna convince those people who themselves live very nice lives because of the way the live? There is a huge amount of social, religious, political and ecconomical problems that have to be addressed. Not to mention that Africa is just unlucky in some areas, for example in general they have a far lower crop yield than most parts of the world, AIDs etc.

If it was as easy as just checking a list to see if a charity does it good enough... I don't need to know about one child who had been saved, I want to know what they do to help the Africans in general. I want to know if what I donate today can result in a new Africa.

I've never said it was that easy. I gave you examples of sources I found in less that 30seconds that give you tips about how to tell what charities are good ones when you said there wasn't any documentation on the issue.

[Mr.Lucifer]

Originally Posted by An Amateur

This is the definition of lazyness yes.

This is not and therfore causes confusion.

I'm not gonna argue about semantics anymore. I do think that you should choose the words a little more carefully, or explain what you mean more clearly in future because to use the wrong word and generalise in the way you originally did does reflect on you.

Wow, I've experienced people taking my sentences apart and taking it out of context, but cutting half-sentence to make my whole point look retarded? Are we discussing or are you trying to make me look dumb?

They don't bother (lacking desire or willingness) to work for a better world. That's what I've been saying ALL ALONG.

"I say lazy africans. That's because my personal experience is that these africans are lazy. There are also few africans who actually do something with their life situation. In the beginning it was because their situation was hopeless. But now as they get help they can't use it fully because they have become lazy over time. It's not racism, it might be a little bit arrogant but as I see it that's the fact. The majority of africans ARE lazy and that might hinder such a project."

I don't know about you, but the only way I can make that make sense is by changing lazy to willingness.